November 21, 2005

Conclusion: Sex II

This was a particularly challenging message. Today we talked about Sex, Homosexuality and Divorce.

A couple of key points: We must call a sin a sin. As hard as it is, especially because of those we love and care about, and the choices that we've made when we look objectively at Scripture we see that Homosexuality, Divorce, and Remarriage are all sins. Jesus is brutally clear on the last two. Look at Luke 16 and at Matthew 19.

Yet, are they unforgivable sins? No. But, we must call them what they are. We must seek decisions based on God's will. We must know that grace abounds.

I don't have all of the answers, but it is clear that this is a hard one to digest. To put into practice, to weigh against the things we take as norm in our culture. Romans 2: We must be careful not to stand in judgement or view one sin worse than another. We are all sinners. We are all in need of a savior.

Church is a place for sinners. Not perfect people. It is where we seek and worship a God who forgives. But we must still call a sin a sin. And Grace, Grace.

John Piper has an interesting article on this, follow the link here and here for a link to more of his research on this topic. It is the most exhaustive work I have found on the topic. At least on the internet.

Also, thanks to anonymous II for the link to the LCMS research on this. It is worth the read.

Follow the link here...
http://www.lcms.org/graphics/assets/media/CTCR/Divorce_Remarriage1.pdf

So, what do you think? What challenges you? What do you agree or disagree with?

Posted by Genesis Worship at 03:34:37 | Permanent Link | Comments (31) |
Comments
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1 - There are people I know who are clearly in unhappy marriages (40+ years and counting) and whose partnerships have deteriorated so that, at best, they live in the same house and just so happen to be married. More sadly than anything – neither spouse is willing to work at finding happiness/intimacy/remotely anything in common with each other. (And they are also of a generation that I think has issues with seeking counseling.)

There is clearly reason to consider divorce but they won’t because of the vows they’ve taken or brutally, I think they don’t exactly know that divorcing at this late date will matter so they figure why not wait it out and see which spouse dies first?

They won’t cheat but somehow I look at their lives and wonder if God’s plan could seriously mean for them to finish their lives in such a depression? Life without intimacy, without ongoing consideration –on a day-to-day basis why would anyone want to live like that? And at the extreme lows, when they’ve talked to me there is almost a coveting to hope for something they can’t have…so…aren’t they sinning anyhow?
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Written by: Tina at 2005/11/20 - 23:58:59
2 - First, let me say how fantastic this sermon series has been. As my husband was saying it makes us want to be better people. I appriciate Pastor Ben's willingness to speak the truth boldly. For me, I'm still reeling over the thou shalt not murder sermon. Who knew I had so much work to do on that one!!
Today was no exception. The truth, while hard to hear, must be spoken. The world has things so watered down, sin is not as obvious as it should be. And yes Pastor Ben, we still like you! (Comment this)

Written by: Anonymous at 2005/11/21 - 00:42:05
3 - After hearing today's sermon, and reading your commennts as well as those of John Piper, I have a question. If remarriage is a sin, why does the church endorse it by performing the cerimony and blessing the marriage? Indeed, WLC pastors counsel couples in this situation, and officiate these weddings regularly. (Comment this)

Written by: Remarried at 2005/11/21 - 03:33:03
4 - After hearing today's sermon, and reading your commennts as well as those of John Piper, I have a question. If remarriage is a sin, why does the church endorse it by performing the cerimony and blessing the marriage? Indeed, WLC pastors counsel couples in this situation, and officiate these weddings regularly. (Comment this)

Written by: Remarried at 2005/11/21 - 03:33:18
5 - Great question Remarried. I think, for me personally this is something I have previously not put much thought to. In fact, the real question for me is not, what have I done, but what will I do. I feel that it will be important to talk about these things with a couple. To seek God's counsel. But, that is a question I don't have my clear answer on yet. Like a lot of us. Before this week, I had not really thought about this. I am very open to your thoughts and insights. (Comment this)

Written by: Ben at 2005/11/21 - 03:47:44
6 - OK, so now what? I'm remarried which means that I sinned by getting divorced originally. However, since that's (sort of) a one-time sin, I can be sorry and repentent and forgiven. Now, remarried is a continual thing. So, both me and my husband (who has only ever been married to me) sin constantly and continually by being married and since the only way out of that sin is to get divorced - creating an additional sin - we lose. No way out. You can't be forgiven for something you're not sorry about. So, by agreeing to marry my husband I've damned him as well? Is there a resolution to this? (Comment this)

Written by: MEK at 2005/11/21 - 04:18:51
7 - I was thinking along those same lines - seems to me that if you apply the verses there really isn't a resolution and how is that helpful?

I wondered if perhaps there's anything to support the thought that the man/woman currently spouse #2 is the man/woman God intended all along to be one flesh then how could that union start out as a sin from the moment you marry?

Thanks to that free-will it's easy to get married and when you do it at an early age I sometimes don't wonder if you really think through all the relationship longevity issues. Just because you marry someone does that mean that is the person God intended you to be with?

Also what of the woman/man who doesn't want to get divorced but the opposite spouse absolutely gives them no other option? Seems to me when there's no choice - why should that person have that heavy of a yoke to bear?

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Written by: Anonymous at 2005/11/21 - 05:01:13
8 - Ben - I'd have to say that I've never heard anyone preach a sermon on either of the issues you spoke about today with the same zeal for uncovering what the scriptures teach. I'm thankful that you are searching for God's truth in His scriptures and helping us understand what the scriptures say. As a church, I hope that we'll always seek God's truth with open hearts.

I think when we talk about these hard truths (which both homposexulaity and divorce are), it's important to remember that we are not saved or comdemned by our deeds but saved only through faith in Jesus. Everyone has sinned and everyone's sins seperate them from God. Everyday, we put our trust in Jesus and depend on Him.

I'd like to throw something out for commentary: What does Matthew 19:11 mean (this occurs later in the passage we studied today): "He [Jesus] answered, "Not all can accept [this] word, but only those to whom that is granted. " It seems that Jesus is acknowledging how hard this teaching arround divorace will be to accept but I'm not sure what this means form a practical perspective.

Additionally, where does Matthew 19:9, which indicates that divorace is acceptable if one party is unfaithful, fit into this picture?

 (Comment this)

Written by: Tim at 2005/11/21 - 05:28:35
9 - My heart is so heavy over these topics. I'm thankful for God's gift of fellowhip as our agape group was able to pray and share over the re-opening of painful wounds. However, we prayed for those who were alone and not able to find relief last night. We especially lifted up those pre-teens and teenagers who may be confused and hurt again. I feel we really need to care for children whose families are currently going through divorce now and those who have experienced God's restoration and healing like that experienced in our family. I know one of my teenagers told me yesterday afternoon that he just didn't get how could God have wanted us to still be in the pain of our history and not in our family now after remarriage. How do we reconcile that our marriage is a blessing and a plan of God's for our lives; a gift providing our children with a home centered in His love and safety? (Comment this)

Written by: a Mom at 2005/11/21 - 16:39:38
10 - This sermon was a "hit and run." You spoke from Scripture but left many critical questions unanswered, especially the remarriage in WLC issue. You had the children leave for the "sex talk," but then left them in the room for a sermon that opens painful wounds for many of them (probably more than 50%) and leaves them worried about their parents' salvation.
I did not comprehend what God fully intended marriage to be until my second marriage. Now I get it and am living it as an example for my kids. Is that sin? (Comment this)

Written by: Remarried II at 2005/11/21 - 17:17:51
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